There’s more than one way to successfully take your offline business, online, and today’s guest shows us that things don’t have to be perfect to make a big impact. Listen to the wonderful Rebecca Sparrow talk about how she successfully and unconventionally moved her business online, to become the professional godmother that every tween and teen girl needs.
Guest – Rebecca Sparrow
Over the past 25 years Rebecca Sparrow has earned a living as a travel writer, magazine editor, TV scriptwriter, radio producer, best-selling author, and more.
These days her passion lies in helping teenage girls (and their parents) navigate high school friendships, have a more positive experience online, and understand that despite what society tells them, they are enough just as they are.
Rebecca had been going into schools and talking to thousands of high school students and their parents for many years, but she wanted to have a bigger impact helping more girls have a better experience of high school, and at the same time be there for her three young children.
Rebecca created the amazing online Lighthouse Plan program for tween girls, and co-created with Jane Sullivan the brand new virtual book club for kids called the Rebel Readers Alliance.
She is the author of three best-selling novels The Girl Most Likely, The Year Nick McGowan Came to Stay, and Joel and Cat Set The Story Straight (co-authored with Nick Earls).
Since 2009 Rebecca has focused on writing non-fiction books for teenage girls to help them navigate those tricky high school years. Those books include Find Your Tribe (and 9 other things I wish I’d known in high school); Find Your Feet (The 8 things I Wish I’d Known Before I Left High School), and the best-selling Ask Me Anything (heartfelt answers to 65 anonymous questions from teenage girls).
Rebecca’s Favourite Quotes
“Everyone has the power for greatness, not for fame but greatness, because greatness is determined by service.” Dr Martin Luther King Jr.
“Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness, that most frightens us. We ask ourselves, ‘Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous?’ Actually, who are you not to be? ” Marianne Williamson
Connect with Rebecca
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Thanks! And a big thank you to Ricky_ardila for their lovely review:
“Nicci… you have made my life so much easier. It is so hard when starting your own small business to also spend a huge amount on marketing. So these podcasts have made a huge impact in our business, it’s all explained so easily and good to follow. Seriously, you are AMAZING!”
Rebecca Sparrow Podcast Transcript
Nicci O’Mara
Today, I have the pleasure of talking with the wonderful Rebecca Sparrow about how she successfully and unconventionally moved her business online to become the professional godmother that every tween and teen girl needs.
Thanks for joining me on this Simply Standout Marketing podcast. I’m Nicci O’Mara, your host. I hope you’re loving the podcast so far and I know that you’re going to love this interview with the wonderful Rebecca Sparrow. For those of you who don’t know Rebecca. She is one of the most inspiring, down to earth business owners I know, which is why I wanted her on as my first guest. Over the past 25 years, Rebecca has earned a living as a travel writer, magazine editor, TV scriptwriter, radio producer, author of three best selling books and more.
These days, however, her passion lies in helping teenage girls and their parents navigate high school friendships, have a more positive experience online, and understand that despite what society tells them, they are enough just as they are. Rebecca has been going into schools and talking to thousands of high school students and their parents for many years, but she wanted to have a bigger impact, helping more girls have a better experience of high school and at the same time be there for her three young children.
With that said, let’s hear Bec’s journey from offline to online and some great tips and inspiration along the way. Welcome back. Thank you so much for coming on the Simply Standout Marketing podcast.
Rebecca Sparrow
Thank you for having me.
Nicci O’Mara
It’s so wonderful to have you here. I’ve really found the work that you do now and your actual journey to get here is so inspiring. I’ve loved watching you grow your business and just you’ve changed so many lives from what I can see anyway. And so that’s why I wanted you to actually be the first person I had on to interview as a business, because I think your story is so inspiring.
Rebecca Sparrow
I can’t wait to get into it with you.
Nicci O’Mara
Well, look, let’s start from the beginning. Did you have one of those fork in the road moments that made you decide to start your business? You know what? Where did the business idea come from?
Rebecca Sparrow
Well, first of all, I am very similar to my father. So I grew up in a household where my dad is quite a creative person and just always thinking of business ideas. And I’m very similar, like my brain just does not shut off. And I think that combined with that was the fact and I was just talking to my mom about this yesterday, that when I got my first you know, I worked since I was 14, but when I had my first proper full time job out of uni in my career, I was the marketing, what was called, the public relations officer for the Australian Red Cross in Queensland.
And I was on about my second day and I came home from work and I was still living at home with my parents and I would have been about 20. And I came home and I said to Mum and Dad, is this it? Is it? And I said, I get up, I go to work. I get home at around 6:00, I have dinner, I go to bed and I go back there again. And it’s not that I didn’t like my job, but I just said to them, I can’t do this.
I just can’t live like this. And it was it was really then I just thought, nope. And it was probably, so I stayed working for other people, I think. Well, and then of course, which will get into later, I guess, I had a big life changing moment when I was twenty seven and through my career in because I got married to a boy in Las Vegas. But anyway. And that’s when I started essentially working for myself.
Yes. Because I blew my life up with him. That’s what I did.
Nicci O’Mara
I think we’ve all got to blow our lives up at some stage. So it makes it interesting.
Rebecca Sparrow
It does. But it was just very interesting to me that, you know, from the age of about 20, I sort of thought to myself, I don’t like this idea of working for other people. I don’t like being told I have to be somewhere at whatever eight or whatever time. You know, this was this would have been 19, about 93. And I think I would have been lucky that I probably start my work at probably nine, which seems nearly quaint now that the office was opening at nine, but it would have been a nine to five.
But yeah, I just sort of thought no I don’t, I needed more freedom, and I think also that lends to I think, you know, the more you get to know your own personality type, and I’m very much an introverted person, so I am quite happy with my own company, like my sister in law very much likes to work, likes to be busy working in office, loves to have all the people. I don’t need people, I can be at home by myself, doing my own thing and really be really content.
I was not phased by lock down at all here.
Nicci O’Mara
But no, I am 100 percent with you. I must say I did over the years considered because small business is hard. I mean, there’s there’s no doubt about it. And there are stages where you just go, oh, can I really do this anymore? And that was for me a few years ago. And I actually went for two job interviews and just went, I can’t do it. I have no desire to go and work in an office with a whole lot of people.
I wouldn’t be able to concentrate because I love I have an office in my backyard that is just, you know, it’s all set up for me. No one else is allowed in here. And I love it. It’s wonderful. Ohh sorry the dog does. In terms of your business, so with you’ve got the Lighthouse programme and you do so many amazing things working with tween and teen girls. And their parents as well. What made you… So you started that business was at 2018 or before then?
Rebecca Sparrow
Oh let me think. I started it when, what year would have it been? Must have been around, it was when my daughter was in grade four so that might have been around 2018 I guess.
Nicci O’Mara
What were you doing beforehand? What made you decide to actually get into working with the tween and teen girls? I know that you’d written some books and things, but.
Rebecca Sparrow
Well, I guess yeah. So for about twenty years I have been working with predominantly girls, sort of pre-teen and teenage girls, and I’ve written books for them and I really had a very successful business, I guess in terms of going out to schools, doing presentations, writing books, you know, back in the day like twenty years ago, you know, I had a write for newspapers or Mamma Mia or… But I really found that as my own kids have been getting older, I just didn’t want to be, I didn’t want to have that feeling anymore, that every time a school booking came in to me that I had to take it, that even if it was a big drive or it was late at night or I just didn’t want that feeling of of having to go.
And also, I think that look I’ve been doing this for 20 years, I’ve been doing this in particular of getting in my car and driving out to schools for a really long time. And I’m tired and I sort of thought, you know, if there’s a way, you know, I’ve been working online a lot since about 2000, probably when I met my friend Mia. So probably about 2010. Really increasingly working online and understanding sort of social media and doing all of that.
And I just sort of thought, I just thought there’s got to be a way that I can just deliver more, you know, reach more kids. This is what I was thinking. I must be able to reach more kids and more parents from home by doing stuff online than actually limiting myself to just getting in my car and driving to a school down the road. And plus I was getting lots of interstate, constantly getting interstate requests and I had really little kids, I had little kids.
And I was like, I can’t just, I don’t have the family support that maybe some people have where I can just get on a plane and go somewhere. I just don’t have that. My husband is an obstetrician. He is never home. He’s constantly delivering babies. I am the primary carer of my three kids. I don’t, I just can’t be jumping on a plane. So I had to start thinking about there must be a smarter way where I can have more of my life back, but at the same time reach more people.
And that’s really what led me to investigate online memberships and online business.
Nicci O’Mara
Yep. And you really have impacted so many more people by doing that and changing, you know, really the model of your business. And I totally understand there are so many women like you and me that we’re having to try to adapt because we have kids, we love our work, but you just can’t keep putting in the huge hours because there are consequences for, you know, for both us with health and all the rest of it, but also fo kids and family.
And when the wheels fall off, the wheels fall off.
Rebecca Sparrow
Absolutely. But I think that for me, the benefit for me of working for myself is I want to be available that if my son, who’s in grade two, they need somebody to volunteer with reading groups, I can go and volunteer in the middle of the day and do that. Also, increasingly, as my kids get older, my daughter is now 12. I don’t want to be getting in the car at night to drive to school when they might need me after school, they want to do stuff with me or debrief, or for whatever it is.
So I was really looking at, how can I maximise, because also I love my career, like I love what I do, I couldn’t, it makes me feel most myself when I’m doing my work. So it’s finding that, I had to find that balance of how do I fulfil that desire in me to be doing this work. But also I do really want to be a present parent. I want to be there for my kids.
I don’t want to be constantly getting in a car and leaving them and that kind of thing. So really online ticked every box for me. And I tell you, because I started three years ago when the pandemic hit last year, and a lot of my colleagues who, you know, are in the school market and go out to schools, their income was gone. I wasn’t affected because everything I do really is online. So I kept going.
Nicci O’Mara
Yeah, well, I remember when I first met you and it was in 2018 at a Steu McLaren event. And I was so inspired by, you know, by your confidence in your drive to get the Lighthouse programme out there, even though I remember you saying I’ve got no sales page, you know, online course material, everything was old school paper based. And I’m just going, who is this woman? I had no idea, sorry, who you were.
Rebecca Sparrow
Yeah. Yep.
Nicci O’Mara
And I went that is just incredible. But, you know, so many people get stuck trying to make everything perfect, you know. What made you decide just to go for it and get it out there?
Rebecca Sparrow
Because I just thought I’ve got nothing to lose. So like when I started. So I can’t remember how I heard about Stu McLarens so somebody must have, I must have seen something. And I think over the last 12 months before that, I must have been loosely talking to one of my friends who’s in business online and saying, you know, look at this online membership ideas.
And really when I started it was a course, it was not a membership. And then I think I floated it on my Facebook page and said to the people who follow me on Facebook, you know, if I could put material together that was to do with raising preteen girls. Would anyone be interested in receiving, you know, some newsletters from me? And then I had some people say, you know, all these people emailed me and said, well I won’t say all?
But let’s say one hundred or seventy people emailed me. And so I said, OK, well, I’m going to charge you sixty bucks and let’s just see what happens. And initially I would write I’d choose topics and I would write, just choose topics in terms of friendships. Here are ten things to know, ten amazing tips about helping your daughter with her friendships when she’s in primary school. And I’d type it all up and then I would just email it to that.
No, then I think I maybe had somebody who would turn it into a PDF. A friend of mine turned it into a PDF for me within like an hour. And then I would email it out to people just as an old fashioned email. And then they paid for it by depositing money in my bank account. That’s how I started.
Nicci O’Mara
But I love it because you took action. You know, when so many of us were, I call it in motion, we were doing things. We were busy. There was, you know, so much to do, but we weren’t actually taking action to make it happen. I just love that you, that you just got out there and just did it. And look at you now. You know, it’s only what sort of two, three years later.
And you’ve got an amazing following. And you. Yeah, you put out some fantastic content and really make a difference to all of these, to all of these girls and their parents and even parents of boys. I mean, I’ve got to say, I follow you. I’ve only got boys. But in it some of the things are just so relevant, even though I’m not your target market, it’s very helpful for me.
Rebecca Sparrow
Because I’ve got boys as well Nicci, I sort of thought to myself, I’m going to sort of broaden it because as my boys get into that tween age group, I sort of thought, gee, there’s nothing out there. There’s so much content out there for girls, moms of girls. There’s nothing out there I feel like, for boys, so I’m going to explore this.
Nicci O’Mara
Could you hurry up on that one? Because, you know, I’ve got a tween and teen. It’s a whole other world. So anyway, it’s all good. What do you find the most rewarding aspects of the work that you do?
Rebecca Sparrow
Just that I think the biggest thing and probably something that I have learnt from Stu McLaren with his tribe programme, which was Love your Members. And my big thing is providing a really safe space for my members and giving them value. So, one of the things that goes with the Lighthouse programme that they get, I have a private Facebook group, which has about one thousand five hundred, predominantly mums, I would say, in there where they just feel safe enough to share the problems that they’re going through.
And if they’re even a bit nervous, they will email me their issue that they’re dealing with with their child. And I’ll put it up in the group anonymously. But it is such a, and it could be anything. I just want, you know, honestly, the topics that we’ve had in there about what people are struggling with, with their kids that they don’t want to put really publicly somewhere. And they’re putting in this group. And the members of my lighthouse plan are so non-judgemental and supportive and without fail, every time we’ve put something up.
And I thought, wow, that is a big you know, that is a big challenge and that is a big problem. Without fail, every time, there’s someone else who’s gone through it. So someone else is gon: that’s just happened here or that happened to us last year. And when somebody else, when you’re going through something really hard with your child that you even feel embarrassed or ashamed or worried or whatever it is when somebody else says to you, it’s OK, me too.
Like we’ve had that to the relief people feel that they’re not alone is massive. And so I really feel like some of the emails that I get from my members just, I guess, thanking me and of how supportive and useful they find it. That’s everything to me. That’s everything to me. And I’m just about to launch a global online book club for kids around the world. And that’s so exciting. And we’ve got hundreds of members, mostly from Australia, but we’ve also got them in New York and Los Angeles and London and Singapore.
And I can’t wait to do that. See if I wasn’t online, I couldn’t do this stuff. I couldn’t have a book club for 10 to 12 year olds, for kids around the world, where we’re all sort of, that is a safe space because we’re attracting kids who are absolute bookworms. We’re attracting kids who are reluctant readers. And we’re also attracting a lot of kids who are on the fringes of social activities who don’t usually join in stuff.
But we’re offering a little safe space. So all of this stuff means, that to me just ticks every box, which makes me feel like I’m doing something that’s useful and helpful.
Nicci O’Mara
I think it’s amazing. And I think the way that you have built your community shows and the way that they obviously talk within the groups and all the rest of it shows the trust they have in you. And that has to be built, you know, that just doesn’t come with good marketing or anything like that, that that is pure, honest, you know, you showing vulnerability and courage and building that trust. And I think one of the things that most business owners find hard is to put themselves out there and tell their real story.
And I think you do that so well, which is why people really feel that great connection with you with regards to telling your story and actually being honest with people and authentic, you know, what advice would you give other people in business to help them tell their story and actually be open and honest and allow them to connect more with other people?
Rebecca Sparrow
Yes, it’s interesting. I have worked incredibly hard on my Facebook community in particular. That’s my biggest support base. And it’s a really it’s a Like-Minded community. So my Facebook page is not big by many standards compared to other people. So I have about fifty thousand followers on my Facebook page. But the thing with that community is that I have incredibly high engagement on that page and I have an enormous amount of trust.
So when I promote something on that page or I wouldn’t even say promote, recommend something on that page, it usually has a very high success rate for people because I don’t do sponsored posts, ever. That’s a decision that I made. I don’t do. And that’s just for me. I don’t judge anyone else, but for me, I don’t do sponsored posts. Everything that you see on my Facebook page is incredibly authentic. I have no problem, part of my mission with that Facebook page, my number one goal, so my number one goal is not to sell you my lighthouse plan or my book club or for me to go into your school.
That is not my goal with that Facebook page. My goal with my Facebook page is to be useful. That’s it.
Nicci O’Mara
And you certainly are.
Rebecca Sparrow
Well that decision then, so when you come at it, from that point of view of how can I be, literally, how can I be of service to the people who follow me? How can I make their lives better? When you look at everything through that lens, then I think you’re willing to, look if I have something happen to me that I think is going to be useful to share because it’s interesting or it’s inspiring or it’s really food for thought, I’ll share it.
Now it looks like, it may look like on my page, I share a lot about myself I actually don’t. I have a really clear line in the sand about how much I’ll show of my children. I don’t talk a huge amount about my children. I don’t show a lot about my house, where I live, what I’m doing. I think it’s important to be clear, because I don’t think, I don’t exist to give myself completely away to social media.
I just don’t. And that’s not a road I want to go down. I’m not interested in showing you every place I’ve been , every meal I’ve eaten. And I can’t live like that.
Nicci O’Mara
But that’s a relief Bec.
Rebecca Sparrow
I’m no good at it. I’m good with words. I’m not good with having to put photos up of everything. But I think when you come from a place of, when you operate an online presence and you come from a place of how can I be of service to the people who are following me, how can I make their lives better? I think that’s when you’re able to make clear decisions of, okay, well, it might be useful if I say this is something that I’ve struggled with or it might be useful to say, gee, when I’m stressed, these are the meditation apps I listen to or whatever it is.
But everyone’s got to have their own line in the sand, I think of how much of yourself you’re willing to share, because I think it’s really important to have some things that are private. I don’t think you have to share everything in your life and serve it up as content. I don’t think that’s what it’s about. I think what it’s about is being useful and helpful to people. Does that make sense?
Nicci O’Mara
Absolutely. And look, I even think from a service point of view, that’s the way I I definitely concentrate on that on my business now, more so than ever before. And I think if you turn your thinking around, whether you’re a bricks and mortar local business or you’re an online business, if everything that you do, whether it be marketing, customer service, anything, your product development, it should be how can I serve my customers?
How can I serve my audience better? What will provide value to them? Because without your customers, without your clients and your audience, you’ve got nothing. Now, it’s I think it’s a really good way of putting it. And I certainly don’t share or I share very, very little, if anything, about my kids, apart from the fact that I have them and my house where I live, anything, because to me I work from home.
So it does blur the lines between home and work. However, when I walk out of my office, that’s it. That’s where it needs to stop. I don’t need to, you know, for people to to see what I’m doing on a weekend in my business, it’s just not necessary. And it also protects my kids as well.
Rebecca Sparrow
And I think it can become, and look, I have got friends who Instagram every second of their lives. And I get that, like I get it and I completely respect it. What this comes down to in business is what you are comfortable with. And I, that’s not me. And I don’t want to spend my weekends with my family in the back of my head thinking this, should I be photographing this? Would this make a good post? Should I put this on Instagram? I don’t want that in the back of my head because I want to be present with my family and social media and my business already takes up an enormous amount of my head space.
I don’t want to be constantly searching for content in my life, on my weekends. But everybody’s line in the sand is different. And so if that’s you, if you’ve got a type of business where you want to be, you know, if that’s part of your image is ‘here’s me with the kids’ and ‘we’re at the park’ and ‘we’re at the, you know, whatever at Woollies’. And that’s great.
Rebecca Sparrow
You know, everyone’s different. I’m not I’m not judging that. But for me, I have to draw a line in the sand somewhere. And so for me, I have to have a distinction of how much I’m going to share of my life and how much I’m going to keep private.
Nicci O’Mara
Oh, absolutely. So now I think that’s very good advice. Now, one thing that I spend a lot of my time working with clients on is differentiation. You know, what makes them unique, what makes them stand out. And there are plenty of parenting and teen experts out there. What do you think makes you unique and stand out from the rest?
Rebecca Sparrow
That is an interesting question, because I don’t really know. I think one of the big things is that people trust me. And I think what I decided a long time ago is I’m really I’m not any kind of an expert. I’m more like a professional godmother. I’m not a parenting expert by any means. But what I’m very good at is helping people find answers. So I like to think that on my page, one of the ways that I’m being useful is that I really follow the 80 20 rule, which is that 80 percent of the time I am not talking about my own business.
I’m not trying to sell you stuff, you know. 20 percent of the time, maybe, I’ll put up something about, you know, one of my memberships. But 80 percent of the time I’m saying, look at this parenting expert here who’s just created this amazing resource or look at this great TV programme that’s coming up that you might want to watch with your teenage sons or here’s great podcast, or I really work on that idea of being useful. And I think that’s one of the secrets as to why I’ve been successful and why people trust me. I’m not constantly trying to sell them stuff.
I’m trying to be useful. And I have, I very much work on an abundance theory, which is I don’t feel threatened by other people who are working in the same space as me. I totally believe there’s room for everybody. So if other people have written something amazing and useful to do with raising teenage girls, I will share it on my page and say this person has created something amazing that’s going to help you. And I think because I operate like that, I think that does make me different.
I think that because people see me as a trusted source of information who’s not just trying to sell them stuff. And because of that, in many ways I’ve become more successful because they trust me and they’ve developed a relationship with me. Does that make sense? Because I’m not trying to sell people stuff all the time. They buy stuff off me.
Nicci O’Mara
It totally does. And look, I also think the fact that you have your target audience is tween and teen girls and their parents. So really and you’re very, everything, all the messaging on your website and on your Facebook page, and everywhere I see it, it is very, very specific. And it is written towards, you know, to appeal to the girls and also to the parents. So I think it’s, you know, talking to girls is very different to talking to boys, as you know, having both.
Rebecca Sparrow
It is. And I think that being very specific about what I do, what I specialise in and what I’m known for is great. So, yes, I will still chased off the boys and whatever. But I am most known for working with tween age in particular tween age or preteen girls with even more specifically, my big speciality is friendship. So I’m really known as someone that you go to when it comes to our kids in primary school with their friendship dramas and having a good time at school and navigating the social aspect of school, that, that’s my thing.
That’s my wheelhouse. So that’s probably what I am best known for. But, because I also post a lot of stuff where I just try and be useful, I have a very good relationship, just in general, with moms, with women, not even moms, women with women, because not all of them have children or are married but you know, I think there are a lot of people who follow me who have kids. There’s also a lot of people who follow me, who don’t have kids.
So I may never sell them anything. But that doesn’t matter. I still am trying to provide. I think the world can be such a bleak place at times, and people spend a lot of time on social media. I try and make sure my page, my Facebook page in particular is always uplifting and helpful.
Nicci O’Mara
And it is. That surprises me that you have followers who don’t have kids at all, but I can see why. I can’t remember, you must have had a post a few weeks ago and it was about what songs you listened to in the morning to get going and make it a fun morning. And the song that you, and of course we play a lot of music in our house, but the song that you suggested was is it called Good Morning?
Rebecca Sparrow
Yes, by Max Frost
Nicci O’Mara
That’s the one. And I absolutely love it. So I now play that every single morning. I even wake my boys up to that. So sometimes it’s not so. The 13 year old does not enjoy that. But that’s okay. It makes me feel in my happy place when it’s all going, you know, when it’s chaos, and everyone’s forgotten everything and all the rest of it. But so it’s just those small things that do make a big difference, which is great.
Now a bit of a question sort of left a field. What keeps you up at night, whether it’s, you know, your business or… No, let’s just go with business. Is there anything that sort of stresses you out sometimes or?
Rebecca Sparrow
Really. I think the thing that would, that would keep me up at night about my business is. Like, I really live to under promise and over deliver. That’s my big thing, under promise, over deliver. And so I worry if I’ve oversold something or like I live for people to be happy like it. If people have ever come to me and said, for whatever reason, I’ve had to count on two hands, the number of refunds I’ve ever had to give for the last plan.
Not Really. But I give them, like if somebody says to me, look for whatever, you know, for whatever reason, this hasn’t clicked for me or haven’t used it or it’s not old enough for my daughter, but I just give people refunds on the spot. I never make people quibble or beg or put them through 20 questions or I’m not interested, if something hasn’t worked for somebody, I don’t want to take their money, you know, and I don’t care. Even if they’ve been using my my membership for six months and I’ve got one month to go. And they suddenly ask, I don’t care. If they’ve been unhappy for whatever reason with goodwill, I give people refunds or and particularly I’m also very big on you know, a lot of people have had financial difficulty in the last 12 months. If people can’t afford things, I just gift things to people. I just, I don’t know. I just, that that would be the thing that worries me. I don’t ever want people to buy something from me and think that wasn’t worth the money. That’s my bill.
Nicci O’Mara
And I think that’s it’s a good lesson for everyone in terms of whether you have a product or service or an online programme, is when it comes to refunds, so many people fight it. And the problem, yes, there are scammers and there are all these other people out there. But at the end of the day, most people try to do the right thing. And do you really want those customers or those clients that aren’t happy and that they want out?
Because you’ve got a lot more goodwill and you’ve, I just had an instance where I bought a product, well we’ve got two things. One was faulty, it was a manufacturing fault when it arrived, but it was a big item. I rang them. They said not a problem. I thought it would be interesting, but they said not a problem. Send it back. We’ll send someone to come and pick it up. Full refund, done, including the post, including the the shipping, done and dusted.
There’s another thing, which was one of the kids Christmas presents that broke a day later due to a battery fault. And they have gone to ground. They will not talk. And the difference in how I now perceive those two different companies is huge.
Rebecca Sparrow
Exactly. I just think and I’m just not interested in creating bad experiences for people. And the number of people who actually do the wrong thing and scam you is so tiny. And if someone is so desperate that to get out of paying me for something that they need to just pretend they didn’t like it to get their money back, I’m happy just to give it to them. Like, if you’re that desperate in life that, you know, you need to have the money, you need to have a refund.
And then that’s okay. I will give it to you. I’m not. And maybe this is the benefit of being online, Nicci, that it’s not really costing me anything. Right. Because what I’m delivering, maybe would be different if it was physical product. I don’t know. But I don’t I don’t mind, just. Well as you said, even with physical products, it’s so, you think better of a company who would like, you know what? I’m really sorry that thing broke for you. We’re going to take care of it. Don’t worry about it. And then you think, you do you think highly of the company. You think you know what? That was such a good experience. I will go back to them and get something else.
Nicci O’Mara
Absolutely, and also, you’ve got to remember, word of mouth works both ways, you tell people about good experiences, but you tell probably twice as many people about bad experiences with companies. And they’re things that you just, if you keep doing them over time, whether they be good or bad, the word spreads. And as they say, word of mouth marketing is one of the most powerful things.
Rebecca Sparrow
Totally. So I think that, you know, I think if people can, you want to have a good experience, if somebody wants a refund or has some kind of a problem, that’s a great opportunity for you to show who you really are. That’s how I look at it. That’s when you get to show what your true colours are in business. And so if you behave with grace, doesn’t matter how the customer is behaving. And just and also, I don’t need to be, I don’t need more drama in my life.
I don’t need to be engaged in a battle with somebody over something. I just, I’ve got other things going on with three children. I’ve got, you know, I got enough problems going on with my boys bopping each other on the head. I don’t need to be having unnecessary drama with the customer. I’d rather just give people a refund.
Nicci O’Mara
I totally agree. There’s enough drama in our lives. Now, if you could do anything to improve your marketing and communication, that would make you have a bigger impact on more people and get the word out to more people. Is there anything in particular that you can think that you would want to do?
Rebecca Sparrow
Yeah, I definitely need to, I need to, I need to learn a lot more. I’m very comfortable with writing. You know, that’s my big thing. I could, I can write posts and write engaging content and connect with people. I’m just not good at all the other tech stuff. I’m not. I’m just not. And I think I really need to step up there and I need to have set up a proper studio for myself for recording videos, or I need to have you know, and that by that I mean I need proper lighting. I need proper microphones. I need, I think I’ve kind of been avoiding it. I’m in denial. I sort of keep thinking I can just keep being a writer. But I think really in twenty twenty one, like I’m doing this interview with you and its like, grab your headphones, I’m like, I’ve got my daughter’s Airpods, like I don’t know what I’m doing. I’m like, I’m in my daughter’s bedroom stealing her like little Airpod things.
So I need to, I really need to step that up and take that more seriously because that’s where it’s going. Video and just podcast, everything. So I yeah, that’s what I need to be doing. I’m in la la land just thinking, I’m a writter, I just write posts.
Nicci O’Mara
But look, I totally, totally get it because for me to starting a podcast was a huge thing because it’s a lot of work, it’s a lot of technology, that you’ve got to learn yet again. I swear I got technology coming out of my ears. There’s so much of it. But yeah, you know, for me, video is something that I avoid, like the plague because I don’t like it. But I also, I spend my life telling clients, you need to do video.
I know very well, I need to do the video. It is one of those things you do. You go, I’ve done consulting for what, twenty five years or something like that. And you go, OK, yes, you have to video. This is how you do it. This is the technology you need. I’ll help you get set up and they go okay well, where are your videos? Like I’m getting there.
Rebecca Sparrow
You go shut up.
Nicci O’Mara
Don’t talk to me about that. Talking about, you know, I don’t have time because I’m too busy with you. That’s my excuse anyway.
Rebecca Sparrow
I hear you, I’m the same but I think, I think I have to get my head around it. And I think because you know what? I think if I want to go next level. And at the end of last year, I really thought to myself, I felt like I’d been wading through mud for about three years and just making things hard for myself. And I thought, you know what, in twenty twenty one, I’m taking my business to the next level.
Now, I don’t really know what I meant by that in my own head, but I just thought, I just thought, I felt like I’ve been playing small for the last three years and I decided, no, twenty twenty one, I’m turning it up a notch. You know, I just thought I’m not going to be kind of feeling imposter syndrome or I don’t know how to do this or who am I to be doing this. And I thought, no, no, no, I’m going to, I’ve worked really hard.
Integrity is at the centre of everything that I do, so I’m not going to keep playing small and I’m going to really put myself out there and see what I can do and see what I can achieve. And I don’t really know what that looks like yet, but I just have a vision of, you know, of being of service to women in particular and kids. And part of that means, if that’s what I want to do, then I know that I either have to get my head around all the technology or I have to employ someone who can do that stuff for me and help me with it.
But either way, I’m going to have to do it, like that’s what it comes down to. So I’m going to have to either do videos or whatever, but I’m going to have to do it.
Nicci O’Mara
Can I recommend this is what I’m looking at as well, is I have VA’s at the moment who help with the technology side of things. So I actually have someone who edits the podcast for me because I’ve now grown to a point where I go, this is ridiculous. My time is worth more, I can be doing other amazing things rather than trying to learn how on earth to edit a podcast. I know I could do it, but seriously, my time is just it’s more valuable. I could either be doing something with the kids or working or I spend a hell of a lot of time working.
Rebecca Sparrow
And coming up with creative ideas. I agree with you. So I have a company that I use who do all of my bills, all of my online stuff, so they build my websites and send out all my emails and all of that. Could I do it myself? Well probably not actually, because I’m hopeless. But I also know my time is well spent, because I’m a creative, my time is better spent coming up with the ideas, writing the content, engaging with members, not spending half an hour building membership platforms or editing videos or whatever.
So you’ve got to, I think that’s playing to your strengths, you know. And of course, when I started out, as I told you, I was just sending out PDFs to people. But as you get more successful as well, then you can outsource to people, you can get people on board to help you so that you’re focussing on what you’re good at.
Nicci O’Mara
Yes, definitely. And I even think a lot of people, they wait and wait and wait going I’ve just got to get some more money, or I need a bit more time and things along those lines, whereas they should have jumped and got help, employed someone or even a freelancer, even if it’s not a part time or full time employee getting someone to actually help you, then you can grow because we sort of get to this point where we go, oh, I can’t grow unless there’s more of me.
And I can either work 80 hour weeks, which is not healthy for anyone, or I can get someone else in to do all the things that I shouldn’t be doing. And that’s one of the big things that I tell a lot of my clients is, OK, you should not be doing this. It is not your job. You should be doing other things that will make you more money.
Rebecca Sparrow
Totally. I totally agree with you. 100 percent, 100 percent. And if people are starting out, if you really are starting out and you don’t have the money, then just keep it simple. You know, you don’t have to be perfect when you start. As I said when I started, I’m sending out a PDF. I started small, but starting is better than not starting. So sometimes, what you need to do is jump and then really madly swim and you’ll figure it out.
Nicci O’Mara
Absolutely. And also things along the lines of just picking one social media channel, not five of them and just picking what are the, what are the 80 percent of things, sorry, what’s the twenty per cent of marketing and business building that I can do that will have 80 percent of the results. There the things that you need to really, really look at. Your messaging and so many people miss looking at, OK, well, really who is my audience and what is my what’s my uniqueness and my messaging?
And for you, you are such a good writer that your messaging is fantastic. But for so many others, they’re not, they’re not authors and fantastic writers, so that’s where they really stumble, but don’t get help to do it. And your messaging at the end of the day is absolutely everything.
Rebecca Sparrow
Yeah, I totally agree with you.
Nicci O’Mara
Now, I’ve got one last question to ask you. Do you have a favourite quote? I love quotes.
Rebecca Sparrow
Oh, I have a few, but one of my favourites, which my husband got put onto a necklace about 20 years ago, is from Martin Luther King, which is everyone has the power for greatness, not fame, but greatness, because greatness is determined by service.
Nicci O’Mara
I love it.
Rebecca Sparrow
Yeah, that’s that’s been sort of a guiding principle of my life. But also there’s a famous, and I won’t read at all now because I can’t remember it off by heart. But there’s a very famous Marianne Williamson quote, which people attributed to Nelson Mandela because he quoted it once in a speech but was actually written by Marianne Williamson, which was something like, it is our light, not our darkness, that most frightens us. We ask ourselves, who am I to be, you know, fabulous? Well, who are you not to be? You are a child of God, and playing small does not serve the world, when we, and it’s something like, when we step into our own light, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same.
I don’t know the full quote. I don’t, I usually have it pinned up, but it’s a Marianne Williamson quite as I said it was. It’s misquoted by people thinking, misattributed, that people think it originally said by Nelson Mandela. But he was quoting Marianne Williamson. And it is so, it’s such a wonderful quote. But it’s that idea that, you know, so often as women, we play small. And because we’re worried about the sort of who does she think she is?
Who does she think she is doing that, starting that business, being in that space. And I think it makes you kind of just shrink down. And I don’t have time for that anymore. You know, I’m about to turn forty nine. And I sort of think if I don’t believe in myself and I don’t back myself, nobody else is going to. And I know that, that I operate from a place of integrity and great intention and service.
So why not me? You know, why shouldn’t I be stepping up and doing what I’m doing? So and that’s the attitude that I want to take into twenty twenty one.
Nicci O’Mara
I love it. It’s, that’s a quote, and I do remember it, I don’t, like you I don’t remember the word for word, but I’m really pleased you brought it up because I haven’t heard that in ages and I’m going to go and find it and and put it up because it is so true. And when you really, really think about it, we do need to stand up. We do need to be the best versions of ourselves that we possibly can.
And I was listening to, I think it was Carrie Green, last night on Audible book and she said, we have so many what ifs in our life. What if this fails? What if people are horrible to me? What if it all goes wrong? And what if I lose money and no one buys from me? She said. But think about it the other way. What if it’s a it’s a resounding success and it’s incredible? What if you take your business to the next stage or you stand up on on stage and talk to one hundred people?
And so I thought that is such a good way of turning all our thoughts, all our sort of limiting beliefs around to go, what if I can I can do this.
Rebecca Sparrow
Yeah. Because it’s so silly that we automatically assume the negative, we automatically assume, well what if it fails and what if I embarrass myself and you know what part of my success has also been? I’m really comfortable with failure. Like not everything that I do works. You know, I try things like, well, that didn’t work. I don’t take it personally. I don’t think everyone’s keeping score of what I do. And if you want to live a big life and do big things, screwing up and failing at stuff is part of that road because nobody creates brilliant things the first time, every time.
So part of it’s such a learning curve of try this, oh no that really didn’t work. You know, I’m going to try this now. It’s all part of it. I just don’t, I’m so comfortable with with failure or things not working. And I think that’s the other reason that I’m having the success that I have because I’m not afraid to put myself out there and give something a go.
Nicci O’Mara
I think you’re absolutely right. And it’s one thing that I’ve got to say I struggled with. It’s like, oh, well, what will people think when this, when this hasn’t worked or had to do this? And at the end of the day, no one cares less.
Rebecca Sparrow
They’re thinking about their own lives of, oh, we’ve got a tax bill coming up or this has happened at my childrens school. They’re really not thinking, people aren’t thinking about us, they’re thinking about themselves. So this idea that everyone’s noticing when we haven’t, you know, achieved something or something didn’t work and talking about us. No, they’re actually not, people are so wrapped up, we’re all wrapped up in our own lives. People really aren’t discussing or noticing what you’re doing.
So we need to sort of have that bit more courage and just put ourselves out there.
Nicci O’Mara
Oh, I agree. I’ve got Brene Brown quote right in front of my desk, which says, Today I choose courage over comfort. And it’s something I say to myself every single day because at the end of the day, it’s about stepping up and being the best that you possibly can be. But look, this has been absolutely amazing. I have loved having a chat to you Bec, and I’d love to keep talking to you, we could talk like this all day. But I want our listeners to actually be able to connect with you online. So where can you tell them? Where can they connect?
Rebecca Sparrow
My biggest communities on Facebook so it’s, Rebecca Sparrow Writer on Facebook, but also I have a website. So if you want to find all the things that I’m doing with tweens and teens, you can find that in my book club. That’s at rebeccasparrow.com
Nicci O’Mara
That is wonderful. I’ll make sure I put all of those links in the show notes as well so people can get hold of those. Look Bec, thank you so much. It has been an absolute pleasure having you on the podcast today.
Rebecca Sparrow
Nicci, I have loved it. I could keep talking to you all day, so we will have to do an update later on this year and see how we’re both going with the videoing.
Nicci O’Mara
You know what? Let’s keep to that. I think that’s a brilliant idea. And also with the not playing small as well. So let’s play that. We will check in later in the year and we’ll give everyone an update and, yep, wonderful. Thanks so much Bec.
Thanks for listening to the Simply Standout Marketing podcast, head over to simplystandoutmarketing.com for the shownotes, downloads and even more great stuff to help you grow your business with marketing made simple.
